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10/16/18 09:04 PM #497    

 

Alan A. Alop

Today President Trump called adult film star Stormy Daniels "Horseface." Daniels, we remember, is the woman who was paid not to speak of her sexual relationship with Trump and then spilled the beans anyways. In the spirit of what's good for the gander is good for the goose, I will now call Trump "Orangutanface."  Or should that be "President Orangutanface"?


10/17/18 11:06 AM #498    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

more re Steve's #1...

“The only way to lower the record-high federal deficit would be to cut programs like Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security,” says Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell after twisting arms to institute a $1.5 trillion tax cut and signing off on a $675 billion budget for the Department of Defense.  

The deficit grew 17% to $779 billion in fiscal year 2018; it has increased 77% since McConnell became majority leader in 2015.  

New Treasury Department analysis on Monday revealed that corporate tax cuts had a significant impact on the deficit this year: 

Federal revenue rose by 0.04% in 2018, a nearly 100% decrease on last year’s 1.5%.  

In fiscal year 2018, tax receipts on corporate income fell to $205 billion from $297 billion in 2017.  

In good times, when Republicans are in total control, our deficit is deepening.

Republican leaders like House Speaker Paul Ryan and Florida Senator Marco Rubio have long indicated their desire to cut federal programs to pay for tax cuts.  

On the campaign trail, candidate Donald Trump promised to leave Medicare untouched.

Majority Leader McConnell has revealed the truth:

Tax cuts to wealthy multinational corporations will NOT pay for themselves.  Tax cuts largely benefiting corporations and the wealthy will be funded by hardworking Americans by slashing Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security.  

Republicans AND Democrats consider the rising federal deficit and the cost of health care major problems facing the US.

Republican Senate candidates should be challenged for jeopardizing coverage for pre-existing conditions, for pursuing an age tax that would charge older Americans more for care, and for targeting the benefits Americans have paid into.

 


10/17/18 02:44 PM #499    

Stewart Myrent

First, I want to thank Alan, for finding what was, apparently, a well-researched photo of this "President Orangutanface".  I found myself wondering, how many orangutan photos did he have to sift through, to find just the right one.  I find the likeness to be remarkable.  I find his staring gaze to be hypnotic - I will believe anything he says, if he could, or would, speak.  Also, Janis, I had a major problem with your typeface selection of 2 posts ago.  It was way too small, even with readers.  Was that in error, or have you forgotten who your audience is?  Old people.  But I was glad to see that your last post was back to normal.  I went to see Bad Times at the El Royale yesterday.  It was pretty good, decent acting, but I was expecting more.

 

 


10/17/18 04:39 PM #500    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Thanx 2x for heads up, Stewart: re Bad Times at the El Royale  &  way too small typeface-- a trick on me and no treat for anyone... no clue how that size typeface happened.  Poking around to figure it out, I leapfrogged on the Forum. 

 

Anyone know what’s happening in Virginia?  Lawmakers are known to pass draconian laws, but really ?!?  What's up with Halloween?  How old is too old to trick or treat?

What am I missing? serious jeopardy for kids over the “legal” limit dressing up and going door-to-door for candy. 

In Newport News, VA, kids can trick or treat until 7th grade or until they turn 12.  After that, it’s a misdemeanor.

In Chesapeake, VA, anyone over the age of 13 who is caught trick-or-treating can be sent to jail for up to 6 months and fined.  

"Kick or Treat"... that's the challenge for my 9 year old grandson at Tae Kwon Do in Oshkosh, WI.

 

 


10/18/18 07:48 PM #501    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Spent most of the day in and around Apple Store in Milwaukee to have the battery replaced in my iPhone.

Cost: $29.99 + tax  in 2018; Cost in 2019 will be  $79.99 + tax.

Milwaukee is happy celebrating Brewers return to Milwaukee for NLCS  Game 6 tomorrow and this afternoon in fast moving lines at George Webb Restaurants to receive one free hamburger apiece.

at Mitchell Airport waiting for my grandson’s Southwest Airlines fall fare flight into Milwaukee to spend his Fall break long weekend with family here in Oshkosh.  My 9 year old grandson is eager to spar his 20 year old black belt cousin.

 

For those willing to reflect: Our heritage as Americans is one of the following:  

Native American, slave, refugee, immigrant  - or -  a combination thereof.

 

 


10/19/18 01:13 AM #502    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

“The November 6th General Election is about your health, and which party wants to protect your health care.”

“The best way to know what Democrats and Republicans believe an election is about is to look at the TV ads they are running in the most competitive races in the country.  Why? Because ads cost money."

Although both parties are running ads about health care (and Trump is tweeting), Republicans - the President, members of Congress, both the House and Senate, and Governors - are running away from their record for full repeal and replacement of the Affordable Care Act, aka Obamacare.  

We've seen and heard the Republicans -- at least those already serving in elective office -- those in the House and Senate over the past two years voted for the full repeal and replacement of the ACA.  Remember John McCain and his thumbs down vote in the wee hours of a summer morning.  Yes, Republicans voted to get rid of the ACA provisions that prevent insurance companies from refusing care to people with pre-existing conditions and that allow a child to stay on his or her parents’ insurance until age 25.  

“Asked which party would do a better job in dealing with health care, CNN-SSRS polling earlier this month showed 54% of American voters answered congressional Democrats while just 36% said congressional Republicans."

Trump and the Republicans are increasingly defensive / dishonest talking about health care.  Republicans do NOT support coverage for pre-existing conditions.  Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan, and Marco Rubio are clear about slashing Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security.

 


10/19/18 10:07 AM #503    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Dear Steve,

Please accept my understanding and condolences on the death of your dear friend. 

No apology necessary for an appropriate rant.  All I can say is ditto, ditto, ditto, resounding ditto.

I do not understand how others remain silent while Trump destroys the Republican party and guts all that's good about the USA.

Janis

 


10/19/18 01:41 PM #504    

Stewart Myrent

​Well, Steve, tell us how you really feel, but, believe me, I get it.  It saddens me that our country has gotten to this point.  Where the commitment to truth has lost it's way.  I, personally, am so sick of being lied to on a daily basis, multiple times a day, by pretty much everyone in this administration, that I can barely stand it.  I frankly don't understand how even 1/3 of the electorate, can believe & support the daily BS that is delivered to us, as though we are a bunch of total morons.  I am particularly disgusted & disappointed by a Republican Congress, that sits idly by & allows this to continue.  So, I get it.  During the Watergate fiasco, a group of Republican Senators, led by Barry Goldwater of Arizona, went to the White House to tell Nixon, that he was going to be impeached by the House of Representatives & convicted in the Senate & that he had to go.  I had this fantasy that a group of leading U.S. Senators, led by John McCain (ironically, also from AZ) were going to go to the White House & tell Trump that he had to go.  However, sadly, John McCain is now gone & I don't see one Republican Senator, having the empathy, the honesty, the determination, the confidence, or the balls to take on such a task.  So, I understand your frustation.  If there is no 'blue wave' in November, God help us all.  Although, if there is no 'blue wave', our fellow citizens will have made their voices heard, and we deserve what we get.


10/19/18 11:14 PM #505    

Stewart Myrent

​Steve, I just want to apologize for, in my previous post, not mentioning & not giving my condolences to you for the loss of a dear, long-standing friend.  However, I frankly feel that in many ways, your friend got very lucky.  You mentioned that he died from a massive stroke.  My greatest fear is to have a stroke, that DOESN'T kill me.  Your friend doesn't realize it, of course, but his fate is infinitely better, than having a perfectly active mind, without the ability to control your physical actions.  I realize it may be difficult to look at it this way, for you, as I'm sure you would rather still have him around & available, but if YOU had the choice, what would you pick?


10/20/18 12:40 AM #506    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

The Houston Chronicle's editorial board endorsed Democratic Senate candidate Beto O'Rourke in his bid to unseat incumbent Senator Ted Cruz in the closely watched Texas Senate race.

"With eyes clear but certainly not starry, we enthusiastically endorse Beto O'Rourke for U.S. Senate.  The West Texas congressman's command of issues that matter to this state, his unaffected eloquence and his eagerness to reach out to all Texans make him one of the most impressive candidates this editorial board has encountered in many years.

"A 'Beto' victory would be good for Texas, not only because of his skills, both personal and political, but also because of the manifest inadequacies of the man he would replace.

"What sets O'Rourke apart, aside from the remarkable campaign he's running, are policy positions in keeping with a candidate duly aware of the traditionally conservative Texas voter he would be representing in the U.S. Senate.

“There’s one more reason O'Rourke should represent Texas in the U.S. Senate: He would help to serve as a check on a president who is a danger to the republic.  Cruz is unwilling to take on that responsibility.  

“Imagine how refreshing it would be to have a U.S. Senator who not only knows the issues but respects the opposition, who takes firm positions but reaches out to those who disagree, who expects to make government work for Texas and the nation.  Beto O'Rourke, we believe, is that senator.”

 


10/20/18 11:17 PM #507    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Businesses in Maine are facing a growing backlash following Senator Susan Collins' 40+ minute speech on the Senate floor endorsing Brett Kavanaugh and her critical vote confirming his nomination to the Supreme Court.  Since the 50-48 confirmation vote when Susan Collins pronounced that though she believes Prof Ford was assaulted, she knows better than Prof Ford who assaulted her, two of Maine's biggest industries, lobster fishing and tourism, are facing consumer boycotts.

To encourage Maine's fishermen to vote Collins out of office, restaurants around the country are looking elsewhere for seafood.  Bearing the brunt of the boycotts is tough for Maines's businesses - the state's lobster industry is already suffering because of the punitive tariffs imposed by China as a result of Trump's trade war -

and -

Susan Collins is not up for re election until 2020.

 


10/21/18 12:06 AM #508    

Stewart Myrent

Hi, Steve.  I just got home from my part-time job, delivering pizzas, & read your latest post with great interest.  I agree with virtually everything you said.  I have told quite a few people that I found turning 70 about 1 1/2 yrs. ago, to be extremely liberating.  I have been so lucky with my health; in over 70 yrs., the only invasive surgery I've had is cataract removal from both my eyes.  So, when I turned 70, I decided if I ever got a cancer diagnosis down the road, I will forgo any entreaties from doctors, etc. to have the necessary surgery & equally necessary follow-up treatments (e.g. chemo, radiation, etc.).  I have known quite a few people who have had cancer surgeries & the requisite chemo & radiation, and they ALL have paid a price.  I get the doctors' motivation - first of all, they want to see if they can save your life & secondly, see if they can extend your life.  But, you're the one who will pay the price, one way or the other.  If you forgo the surgery, etc., I'm pretty sure they can keep you pretty comfortable, with all the great drugs they have.  I think when we were kids, someone in their 70's was pretty old & I don't know how many of us thought we would make it to 70.  I'm pretty sure I didn't, but that's why I found turning 70 to be liberating.  To turn 70, without any lingering health problems, is a very lucky turn of events.  But, what if I don't get that cancer diagnosis in my 70's?  Am I going to be in any better physical shape, or is my mind going to be sharper, when I'm 82?  Don't think so!  So, I guess there's a reason none of us knows when, or how, it's going to end (my guess is, Choice #1 would be dying in your sleep), but that's the joy of life.  I'm very sorry to hear about you losing your friend.  I would say he's in a better place, but that's probably because he got the hell out of here.  And I might add, perhaps, just in the nick of time.


10/21/18 01:54 AM #509    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Stewart, I’m so glad you’re a regular on the Forum.  You give us a lot to chew on.  I too am relatively healthy-- though I should exercise more.  I am not looking to die, but have no desire for miracle cures that might keep me alive to suffer...

I want family and friends to remember me with smiles and good memories.  I’ve learned there’s no good time to die--

At 72 life is gravy... death comes in the course of life...life and life events keep happening for the living.  I am grateful for the quality of life I enjoy.  I have been treated for stage 1A breast cancer, have mammograms, and see the dental hygienist regularly... At this time, I agree with you and Steve-- no miracle cures.  

On good advice, I’ve been told FLU SHOT, YES!!!  but NOT to despair if I have to wait 'til next year for new shingles shots.

 


10/21/18 11:34 AM #510    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Steve, there have been severe side effects to the Shingrix vaccine in the shingles shots... please see 800# to contact the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System.  

1-800-822-7967

The vaccine will be improved-- those who have not already begun the series might want to wait ’til the shingles vaccine has been improved.  Shingrix is presently on back order.

 


10/21/18 03:04 PM #511    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Steve, the link to the article with 800# is below.  I referenced the article for validation of the stories I’d heard about people spending time in bed because of side effects of Shingrix shingles shots this year.

You are right to challenge me-- people should consult with their doctor before delaying shingles shots.

Shingrix is used in both the first and second vaccinations of the new series, so side effects are possible following both shots.

https://www.healthline.com/health/shingles-vaccine-side-effects#outlook 

The article also mentions Zostavax which has been used in the past and is not as effective as Shingrix.  Shingrix is presently on back order in my neck of the woods.

I had chickenpox as a child and shingles as a teenager-- not a fun reason to be absent from Niles West or think about experiencing again.

Please post link(s) to your info.

 


10/21/18 04:03 PM #512    

Stewart Myrent

​Hi, Steve.  Saw your recent post & only thing I didn't understand, was your reference to my faith.  I was very surprised, as no one has ever accused me of having too much faith, in anything.  I am getting ready to go to work again.  Just got done watching the Bears lose to the Patriots 38-31.  I work at Wayne's Pizza in Third Lake, IL.  That's right - Third Lake.  That's OK, I never had heard of Third Lake, either, but I moved about 1 1/2 mos. ago to Hainesville, IL, which I actually had heard of, after living in Schaumburg for 5 yrs.  The pizza is actually quite good at Wayne's & no, we don't deliver to Thailand.  If the pizza in Thailand is anything like the pizza on the West Coast, you have my sympathies.  Do they sell pizza in Thailand?  Relative to Janis' remarks on the shingles vaccine, I have not had the shingles shot yet, though I have thought about it.  I was totally unaware of any problems with the shingles vaccine, so thanks for mentioning it.  I have known several people who have gotten shingles, including my dad, and it sounds disgusting & I hear it's very painful.  I need to eat something pretty quickly, before I head out the door to work.  I don't mind getting off the political rants & I don't mind talking about pizza, but I was a little concerned about turning to thoughts about death.  I didn't want to be too maudlin.  Talk to you all soon.


10/22/18 05:03 PM #513    

Stewart Myrent

​Hi, Steve.  When I said your friend, Jeff, was in a better place, I was half-joking, not as a reflection of any belief, on my part, in an afterlife, or reflecting a religious view, in any way.  I was hoping that I gave a clue, when I said he may have gotten out just in time; that was actually a reflection of my political fears, about the current political climate, in that he will not have do endure the daily onslaught of bull---- & out & out lies, that we face every day.  As for Third Lake, IL, I actually also wondered if there was a First Lake & Second Lake, IL.  Sad to say, as far as I know, Third Lake is it for IL.  Never have heard of either First or Second Lake.  I prefer thin-crust pizza & Wayne's is excellent, but I tried their deep-dish pizza last week & I was surprised how much I enjoyed it.  I do have one question, though.  I believe this is the 5th or 6th daily post in a row for me & I was wondering if I have lost that "lurker" epithet.  Frankly, the term "lurker" always seemed a little creepy to me.  So, is this like the SNL 5-timers club, for people who have hosted the show 5 times, or more?  Just curious.


10/22/18 05:40 PM #514    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Steve, have no doubt I believe in preventive health care... I accept shame for suggesting there are anecdotal stories that should encourage or justify classmates delaying vaccinations with Shingrix ‘til next year.  Many have already been vaccinated with Zostavax so I meant to give procrastinators cover and / or heads up about waiting for improvements to Shingrix vaccine to avoid side effects... I believe the article mentioned "severe side effects".  I accept the reasons you cite for the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System 800# . 

I had chickenpox as a child and shingles as a teenager... far be it from me to take shingles lightly and to discourage our classmates from doing what they can to protect themselves from shingles. Taking the time for clarity is important to me. 

I regret discouraging classmates from availing themselves immediately of an effective preventive.

I am deeply concerned about the vaccination scare that has led some parents to not getting their children vaccinated.  There is no way I want to contribute to that scare and the return of diseases thought to be eradicated.  You and I are in total agreement that the "absolute best health care plan is to not get sick.  Hence all effective vaccines make sense."

Thank you for drawing attention to the serious matter of vaccinations and public health.  Hopefully the back and forth of our exchanges catches others’ attention and prompts some to be more serious about vaccinations and shingles vaccinations in particular. 

 


10/22/18 05:46 PM #515    

 

Donald Henry Kuehn

Steve (and others)

While I concur with your assessment of “miracle cures” it depends on what you consider to be a miracle and what has proven to be an efficacious treatment for known diseases. I also think it may be a bit callous to be discussing this while our “Den Mother” and guiding light (even in her absence from this site) is preparing for another round of chemo. I’m sure we all send our love and best thoughts to Sharry.

Like probably everyone our ages, I have seen the good and the bad from such treatments. My wife underwent both chemo and radiation more than 17 years ago and remains cancer-free to this day. It wasn’t without some pain and discomfort, but it is a proven course of action in many cases. Thanks to the doctors at the University of Kansas Cancer Center (and other teaching/research institutions), the advances in measured treatments have improved tremendously over the years and I am grateful for every one of those steps forward.

On the other hand, one of my best friends and golf partners (we won the Kansas Senior Fourball in 2006) had pancreatic cancer. Even though he was positive and optimistic about his future, that’s a diagnosis that defies a cure in most cases. He went through a series of treatments that left him gradually more and more debilitated, unable to function and eventually it took his life. It was, indeed, sad to see and makes one question what value there is to a few months of a painful existence that mocks the quality we all want.

There are no easy answers, and no blanket conclusions applicable to every situation or every patient. I don’t dispute your position and I tend to agree with you (as it might pertain to myself) but there is much to be considered in each particular case.

OMG, wouldn’t an Uno’s Pizza taste great right about now? Stop the pizza talk!

DK


10/22/18 09:13 PM #516    

Stewart Myrent

​Hello, Don.  I read your post & was very glad to hear that your wife had successful treatment for cancer over 17 yrs. ago.  However, it sounded to me like going through with the surgery & the follow-up chemo & radiation, was not without it's share of problems, which I would expect.  However, the key to me was that it was 17+ yrs. ago.  If I was 55-yrs. old, instead of being almost 72-yrs. old, I might consider having cancer surgery with the attendant chemo/radiation.  Being in my 70's changes everything for me.  I have no desire to have my life extended, if that life means suffering through the results of chemotherapy and/or radiation.  Both of those things, I don't have to  tell you, beat the hell out of the human body.  You not only have to be tough, you have to be lucky, also.  Relative to your friend who was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, they never cure pancreatic cancer.  As I understand it, by the time you are symptomatic with pancreatic cancer, you are already Stage 4, too late to do a thing for you.  Brain cancer is another one they don't seem to have much luck with.  I only know one person, who has survived brain cancer & she was relatively young.  On a lighter note, I was caught by your nostalgic memory of Uno's.  For some reason, I always preferred Pizzeria Due - don't know why.  I understand they had exactly the same pizza & they were about a block apart, but for some weird reason, I almost always wound up going to Due's.  But thanks for the nostalgia, as I plan to never go into the city, probably for the rest of my life.  I don't like it there any more.


10/23/18 10:41 AM #517    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Do NOT give credence to my medical ruminations... what I say is me looking to find my way.  Having said that, I agree with you, DK - there is efficacious treatment for known diagnoses.  I was diagnosed and treated for Stage 1A breast cancer.  It was the right thing (for me) to do.  There are more difficult diagnoses with harder questions to answer and no blanket conclusions... John McCain's treatment afforded him the luxury of enjoying family and friends and writing a book and the tribute delivered by his daughter Meghan at his funeral and establishing The McCain Institute, non-partisan and part of Arizona State University, which does not support or oppose any political party or candidate-- watch for ads by mavericksneeded.org .  Mazie Hirono's treatment affords her and Hawaii the benefit of her representation.  Two distinct courses of treatment for different cancer diagnoses of two patients.  

As an active participant on nileswest64 website - - -  Thank you, Stewart, for choosing to become active on the Forum.  I have not heard of a First Lake or a Second Lake in Illinois, but I have heard of a Fourth Lake in IL.  I too prefer thin crust pizza-- cauliflower crust pizza too.

Steve, I agree, decisions might change, staring Death in the face.  None of us know the future or for certain the choices we'd make.  What we do know: there is no life without risk.

Meanwhile, to those whom it may concern, check with your doctors about being vaccinated against shingles... "absolute best health care plan is to not get sick.  Hence, all effective vaccines make sense."

 


10/23/18 11:40 AM #518    

Stewart Myrent

​Janis, I am stunned to hear that there IS a Fourth Lake, IL, as I have never heard of Fourth Lake, or any other numerical lake in IL, other than Third Lake.  Do you have any idea what part of Illinois, Fourth Lake is in?  I was equally stunned to hear that there is such a thing as cauliflower crust pizza.  Never had it, but it sounds good to me.  Thanks for the kudos about getting off the sidelines.  My shortest post ever!


10/23/18 06:47 PM #519    

 

Janis Kliphardt (Emery)

Stewart, Fourth Lake is in Lake County, IL. There’s a Fourth Lake Resort in Lake Villa. Fourth Lake borders the Lake County Forest Preserve District, adjacent to and south of the village of Lindenhurst and east of Venetian Village. Fourth Lake is listed on the Natural Areas Inventory.* The area around Fourth Lake was originally slated as out lots for the Venetian Village subdivision but the land was unsuitable for building due to the surrounding wetlands. Fourth Lake has a fen that drains into it and Fourth Lake drains eastward via Mill Creek to the Des Plaines River. Fourth Lake and its fen ecosystem are home to a diverse animal community and a variety of endangered plant species. Fens are rare wetlands with high-quality calcareous floating mat, sedge meadow and marsh, like the Morainal Section of the Northeastern Morainal Natural Division. The grade A calcareous floating mat is one of ten in Illinois.

*The Illinois Natural Areas Inventory program is administered by the Illinois Department of Natural Resources Division of National Heritage.  

Milton’s Craft Bakers makes thin and crispy (gluten-free) cauliflower crust pizza.  Costco sells 2 pizzas separately wrapped in one package in their frozen food section.  Oprah may have a recipe for cauliflower crust pizza-- I don’t know if it’s gluten-free.

I understood your clue about “getting out just in the nick of time”... there’s no excuse for “the daily onslaught of bull*#%* & out & out lies that we face every day"... and now Trump’s bragging about being a “Nationalist”-- we have a president who has no clue what it means to be an American.  

I’m so glad you abandoned the “ ‘lurker’ epithet” (which does seem to call some intrusive)-- and choosing to be an active voice on the Forum... Thanks for taking / making time to post-- it’s a delight to find and read your messages. 

Please do us both a favor / protect yourself from shingles and help me to redeem myself-- Seriously look into getting your shingles vaccinations-- Shingles are disgusting and very painful-- even worse PHN (postherpetic neuralgia) is a possible long-term effect.  With PHN the pain, itching, burning, and tingling that come with shingles do not disappear when the rash is gone-- PHN can last for weeks, months, or years after the rash has healed.

 


10/23/18 07:47 PM #520    

 

Marvin Irving Blusteln

Don,

You can get Malnati's shipped.   Not Due's but a good substitue.   I get them severals times a year.

loutogo@malnatis.com


10/23/18 10:01 PM #521    

Stewart Myrent

 

Janis - Yikes!  I did ask what part of Illinois, was Fourth Lake in.  I am fairly certain that information is probably available on-line, but I'm not sure I would have taken the time to check out Fourth Lake.  So, is it Fourth Lake, or is it Fourth Lake Resort?  You say it's on the Natural Areas Inventory (presumably better known by it's acronym - the NAI).  What the heck is the NAI?  I've never heard of it - have you?  Although I have heard of fens & had a reasonably good idea of what they are.  But, I really love your posts.  I really like people who have inquisitive minds & empathetic hearts & you have both & so does Steve & a lot of other people, who, to me, are the products of being well-raised children.  More on that later. I appreciate the info on the cauliflower pizza crusts, but that presumes that I would actually take the time to make a pizza from scratch.  Have no plans to do so, but if I was, I would probably buy the 2-pack at Costco, in the frozen section, and throw one of the crusts out.  I am still wrestling with the decision about whether to vaccinate, or not, with the shingles vaccine & if any on this Forum can address getting shingles w/o getting vaccinated, from personal experience, please let me know.  If you have any horrific details, don't hold back, because I think it might help propel me over the edge & get vaccinated.  I have to say, it's way more fun being a participant, as opposed to being a "lurker". but we need to find a new epithet.  I'm pretty sure "lurker" has some negative connotations.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Janis - Yikes!  I asked in what part of Illinois would you find Fourth Lake.  Now, I realize that this information is probably available on-line, but I'm not sure that I would have taken the time to look up

 

 


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